Problem with PDF to DWG conversion (Programs: AutoDWG, AutoCAD 2006 / 2014)

[styval]

First I'd like to clarify that I'm not a personal user of these programs, but that I do help my father who uses them extensively. He occasionally runs into trouble with a program and I try to help him as his son, but this is a problem I cannot solve and have come looking to forums about AutoCAD as a solution. I'll provide as much information as I can, get what I'm missing if anyone requires it, and do my best to provide everyone with the tools they need to hopefully help solve my problem. If I posted in the wrong subforum please feel free to move it.

 

The problem is converting a PDF to DWG using the program AutoDWG PDF to DWG Converter, version 3.21 (2009). My father tells me he hasn't had a problem using this to convert PDFs to DWGs since he's been using it. Here is what happens -- using the program he selects the PDF he wants to convert, selects the appropriate version of AutoCAD (and we've tried both 2006 and 2014, as he has both), and then converts. Usually this provides a DWG file that he can open and immediately use. However it provided a block of nothingness.

 

Here is a screenshot of the PDF: http://gyazo.com/8f3b35b5bffdb71e90360a83fba00342

Here is a screenshot of the DWG after conversion: http://gyazo.com/3c318d9d1722bfe7aba2ad0a28548609

 

After some google-fu I've come up short with an answer. I tried using a very small glow-effect in Photoshop and saving that as a PDF, it gave me a conversion that opened in AutoCAD but my father said that he could not move individual lines or alter it to any effect he normally can, so it turned out it did not work.

 

Any help is appreciated, I'm hoping this isn't something dumb and I just can't figure it out. Please ask for any more info needed and I'll give what I can. Maybe there is an easier way to convert PDF to DWG -- if so I'd love to know to pass it along. Thanks.

[Dana W]

I'm going to hit the basics since I don't know your experience level with this type of conversion, I don't know the program you are using to do the conversion, and I personally don't convert pdf docs to dwg files because the conversion programs all have such highly inaccurate results. This is probably why AutoDesk has never included this function in AutoCad.

 

Are you possibly dealing with a raster image pdf as a source document, those consisting of pixels only? I can almost guarantee the output from Photoshop was a raster pdf.

 

You can only convert vector based pdf documents to editable dwg files, those that are made up of mathematically generated lines.

 

If these are raster pdf docs, the conversion program should have an error trap or message for this right up front. It should tell you a raster will not be editable.

 

Of course, it is possible that the conversion program will generate a raster IN a dwg file since the user can bring raster images (photos) into AutoCad and use them for many things; as a cross referenced dwg file, or an inserted background image, or even a source image for a 3D surface material.

 

The most common source for vector based pdf files are other drafting programs. The most common source for raster pdf documents are scanned hard copies and photo processing software.

[styval]

The PDF is a scanned image, it's from some book that he's using to show someone something. So from what I'm gathering, this means that it's probably be a raster pdf, which means it won't be able to be converted to an editable dwg file. Does that sound correct? So the problem is mostly coming from the source (it being a scanned image).

 

So is there a potential way to get this image in a vector based pdf? I'm not quite sure if that's what you meant when you said it could generate the file IN a dwg file. Sorry for not being able to follow 100%, but I appreciate you simplifying things as much as possible for me. Makes it a lot easier to understand.

[Dana W]

The PDF is a scanned image, it's from some book that he's using to show someone something. So from what I'm gathering, this means that it's probably be a raster pdf, which means it won't be able to be converted to an editable dwg file. Does that sound correct? So the problem is mostly coming from the source (it being a scanned image).

 

So is there a potential way to get this image in a vector based pdf? I'm not quite sure if that's what you meant when you said it could generate the file IN a dwg file. Sorry for not being able to follow 100%, but I appreciate you simplifying things as much as possible for me. Makes it a lot easier to understand.

Yes you do have a raster image. All photographs on a computer are raster images, whether they are scanned or camera produced, and a lot of the time pdf's fall into this group. There is not enough software sophistication built into the average scanner to interpret the pixels it sees as lines, at least outside of DARPA.

 

Think of a raster image as a stack of bricks with random colors of bricks just anywhere.

 

Think of a vector image as a set of coordinates between which software can direct a printer to draw lines or curves.

 

The raster will not convert to a vector based image at all since it is pretty much one big object. The only alternative is to trace over the image "lines" within AutoCad, erase or turn off the raster image, and then print your new drawing to a pdf vector drawing using AutoCad's output options. I know 2014 will plot to pdf, but I don't think 2006 will. There is a "plotter" (dwg to pdf.pc3) which when selected will plot to a pdf doc.

 

Some people will say that there is software available to convert raster to vector, but from what I have heard, you will have to spend so much time correcting the output, that you may as well draw it from scratch if you have dimensions, or trace it if you don't.

 

What I meant by your converter program generating a raster image inside a dwg file is simply that the output result will end up as a dwg file since that is one of the output selections, I am assuming.

 

AutoCad can accept raster images through the IMAGEATTACH command, so it would be easy for the converter program to take advantage of this capability, the result being a drawing file with nothing in it but the raster image.

 

If you have this scanned image already on the computer, your Father can simply imageattach it to a dwg without bothering with the conversion program at all.

 

The image will then be in a drawing, at its actual size. For instance, an 8 1/2 x 11 letter size pdf will be exactly that size attached in AutoCad. Then, there are ways to "scale" the image up or down to get it to what would be the actual size of the image contents. Scaling up does tend to cause a LOT of image quality loss though.

 

I hope I have not made this even muddier for you.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Dana W
corrected spelling and grammar, clarification.

[ReMark]

AutoDesk has a program called AutoCAD Raster Design that can be used to convert from raster to vector format.

[RobDraw]

I'm with Dana one this. The best way to convert a raster image to an workable .dwg is to draw/trace it yourself. If your father just needs to make minor alterations and would prefer not having to draw it, many of the free conversion programs will do an adequate job. Just remember that you get what you pay for.

[styval]

My dad came back from the job site he was at this morning and I talked to him after trying a few things on my own. I used AutoCAD Raster Design 2014 this morning to try making it work, but like Dana said the image wasn't high enough quality and it continually gave me the error "No valid raster found," which according to my google search for the error just mean quality problems. I tried this since it sounded easy and I could do it without my Dad being here. Worth a shot.

 

I talked to him since he came back and he said that that drawing it was what he was going to have to end up doing if I couldn't find anything else that would make it easier, and since none of the programs I tried after AutoDWG worked, including Raster Design, he says this is what he'll do. I appreciate all the help you guys offered, and thanks a lot for making everything so easy to understand for me Dana -- I learned a lot over the last day about AutoCAD / Drafting compared to what I knew two days ago lol. Great forum, thanks for all the help.

[Dana W]

Maybe the image was already scaled up? Once the pixels are enlarged (image resolution degradation) maybe the converter can't recognize it as an image any longer.

 

...and I could do it without my Dad being here.

[ROBP]

First I'd like to clarify that I'm not a personal user of these programs, but that I do help my father who uses them extensively. He occasionally runs into trouble with a program and I try to help him as his son, but this is a problem I cannot solve and have come looking to forums about AutoCAD as a solution. I'll provide as much information as I can, get what I'm missing if anyone requires it, and do my best to provide everyone with the tools they need to hopefully help solve my problem. If I posted in the wrong subforum please feel free to move it.

 

The problem is converting a PDF to DWG using the program AutoDWG PDF to DWG Converter, version 3.21 (2009). My father tells me he hasn't had a problem using this to convert PDFs to DWGs since he's been using it. Here is what happens -- using the program he selects the PDF he wants to convert, selects the appropriate version of AutoCAD (and we've tried both 2006 and 2014, as he has both), and then converts. Usually this provides a DWG file that he can open and immediately use. However it provided a block of nothingness.

 

Here is a screenshot of the PDF: http://gyazo.com/8f3b35b5bffdb71e90360a83fba00342

Here is a screenshot of the DWG after conversion: http://gyazo.com/3c318d9d1722bfe7aba2ad0a28548609

 

After some google-fu I've come up short with an answer. I tried using a very small glow-effect in Photoshop and saving that as a PDF, it gave me a conversion that opened in AutoCAD but my father said that he could not move individual lines or alter it to any effect he normally can, so it turned out it did not work.

 

Any help is appreciated, I'm hoping this isn't something dumb and I just can't figure it out. Please ask for any more info needed and I'll give what I can. Maybe there is an easier way to convert PDF to DWG -- if so I'd love to know to pass it along. Thanks.

 

Post the original pdf i will converted for you to test the program i have installed.

 

R

[styval]

Post the original pdf i will converted for you to test the program i have installed.

 

R

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bx-axzeOSUwcR1JTM2drT3hzNkFHZUtaY0l0cDJVWEd1YVpR/edit?usp=sharing

 

Let me know what program it is if it works, I'd love to know.

[SLW210]

My dad came back from the job site he was at this morning and I talked to him after trying a few things on my own. I used AutoCAD Raster Design 2014 this morning to try making it work, but like Dana said the image wasn't high enough quality and it continually gave me the error "No valid raster found," which according to my google search for the error just mean quality problems. I tried this since it sounded easy and I could do it without my Dad being here. Worth a shot.

 

I talked to him since he came back and he said that that drawing it was what he was going to have to end up doing if I couldn't find anything else that would make it easier, and since none of the programs I tried after AutoDWG worked, including Raster Design, he says this is what he'll do. I appreciate all the help you guys offered, and thanks a lot for making everything so easy to understand for me Dana -- I learned a lot over the last day about AutoCAD / Drafting compared to what I knew two days ago lol. Great forum, thanks for all the help.

 

You will need to convert the PDF to an actual image file type (PNG, JPG, etc.) to have Raster Design convert to AutoCAD, it will not convert a PDF. Photoshop or Gimp will do this.

[Dana W]

You will need to convert the PDF to an actual image file type (PNG, JPG, etc.) to have Raster Design convert to AutoCAD, it will not convert a PDF. Photoshop or Gimp will do this.

Oh, it was still a pdf then.

[styval]

You will need to convert the PDF to an actual image file type (PNG, JPG, etc.) to have Raster Design convert to AutoCAD, it will not convert a PDF. Photoshop or Gimp will do this.

 

The program only lets you insert actual image files as far as I know from my limited use of it (like 10 minutes), so I was aware of this and I did have it saved as a PNG. It would still not convert because of the error message I posted earlier in the thread.

 

I'm still checking back hoping user: ROBP has luck with his program.

 

Quick edit: Maybe something's wrong with the image, if it's not a quality issue. I just uploaded it to Drive real quick just in case that's a problem -- just trying to be proactive for potential learning situations.

[ROBP]

The program only lets you insert actual image files as far as I know from my limited use of it (like 10 minutes), so I was aware of this and I did have it saved as a PNG. It would still not convert because of the error message I posted earlier in the thread.

 

I'm still checking back hoping user: ROBP has luck with his program.

 

Quick edit: Maybe something's wrong with the image, if it's not a quality issue. I just uploaded it to Drive real quick just in case that's a problem -- just trying to be proactive for potential learning situations.

 

Unfortunately the pdf did not contain any vectors, therefore since the pdf was a scanned image without vectors and not generated from cad software.

The only option you have is to insert it with pdf underlay and scale it and draw over it.

 

Best yet redraw according to dimensions and create dynamic blocks while at it for future use.

 

Good luck.

 

R

[RobDraw]

Unfortunately the pdf did not contain any vectors, therefore since the pdf was a scanned image without vectors and not generated from cad software.

 

I think we knew that when the OP said that it was scanned in from a book.

 

The only option you have is to insert it with pdf underlay and scale it and draw over it.R

 

This is not the only option. You and others have given several.

 

my father said that he could not move individual lines or alter it to any effect he normally can.

 

Did he try exploding the objects that contained these multiple lines? They may have been blocks or polylines.

 

When it comes to conversion software, the better resolution of the image, the better the output you will get. Garbage in, garbage out. Also, the ones that cost money can do a better conversion but are reliant upon having a high resoution image or even "guidance" from the user in a tracing type of format. I think RasterDesign was one that did but it required a lot of user input.

 

Also, there are several conversion programs out there. Some better than others but none are capable of a true conversion. Some can recognize text, lines, and arcs, but even with that capability they all fall short of creating a good CAD drawing.

 

For the OP's situation, I would try to get the page from the book scanned in at a higher resolution and try the program(s) that he has again or even one or more of the others. He can probably use one of the ones that cost money on a limited trial basis.