Need feedback for ordering new computer for autocad use

[gbelous]

the night one was done in 2006, middle one was 2007 and interior in 2010

[ReMark]

School never looked like that when I attended. Nice job.

 

My middle school looked more like the Goodrich Castle dungeon!

[gbelous]

haha same here....thanks.

[gbelous]

This is what one of our IT guys came back with for a total of about $3k...any feedback? I put --- next to the items I am guessing are the most critical.

 

---Dell Precision T3500,CMT,Standard Power Supply,C2

---Quad Core Core Intel Xeon W3565 3.2GHz, 8M L3, 4.8GT/s,Dell Precision T3500

---24GB, DDR3 ECC SDRAM Memory 1333MHz, 6X4GB Dell Precision T3500

Dell USB Entry Keyboard,No Hot Keys,English,Precision Desktop

Monitor Option-None

---2GB AMD FirePro V5900,3 Monitor 2DP and 1DVI,Dell Precision TX500

---256GB Solid State Drive,SATA 3,Fixed Precision TX500

---C30 SSD Boot + SATA drive, Non-Raid, 2 drive total configuration, T5500/T3500

No Floppy Drive, Dell Precision

Windows 7 Professional,No Media, 64-bit,Fixed Precision, English

Windows 7 Label, OptiPlex, Fixed Precision, Vostro Desktop

Windows 7 XP Mode,Opti/PWS/Lat/Vost

Dell Client System Update (Updates latest Dell Recommended BIOS, Drivers, Firmware and Apps),Precision Desktop

Dell MS111 USB Optical Mouse,OptiPlex and Fixed Precision

Mini-Tower Chassis Configuration, Dell Precision T1500 and T3500

16XDVD AND 16XDVD+/-RW, Data Only, Dell Precision T3500

Power Cable,serial ATA,OpticalDell Precision T3500

Cyberlink Power DVD 9.5,No Media, Dell OptiPlex, Latitude and Precision Workstation

Roxio Creator Starter,No Media,Dell OptiPlex, Latitude and Precision Workstation

No Speaker option

Documentation,English,Dell Precision

Power Cord,125V,2M,C13,Dell Precision

---2TB SATA 3.0Gb/s,7200 RPM,Hard Drive with 16MB DataBurst Cache,Dell Precision TX500

Integrated Intel chipset SATA 3.0Gb/s controller,Dell Precision T3500 and T5500

Energy Star Not Selected,Dell Precision Desktop

No Resource CD for Dell Precision Desktop

Trend 3.5, Micro Worry-Free Business Security Services, 30 Day, MUI, Dell OptiPlex, Precision and Latitude

Quick Reference Guide,English Dell Precision T3500

Shipping Material for System Dell Precision T3500

No Productivity Software,Dell OptiPlex,Precision and Latitude

Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Plus Onsite Service Extended Year(s)

Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Plus Onsite Service Initial Year

ProSupport : Next Business Day Parts and Labor Onsite Response 2 Year Extended

ProSupport : Next Business Day Parts and Labor Onsite Response Initial Year

ProSupport : 7x24 Technical Support , 2 Year Extended

ProSupport : 7x24 Technical Support , Initial

[ReMark]

I like what I see. It is nice to also see an IT person thinking about an extended warranty with next business day parts and tech support.

[f700es]

Yeah it looks good. I would swap out the Ati card for an nvidia but that is just my opinion.

[gbelous]

f700es, looking at the parts difference with the items you gave me from newegg, there is a $1000 difference. but how much of that do you think would be made up for in the time it takes to build the system plus any additional parts like the tower frame, additional wires, etc. that is needed to actually put it all together?

[gbelous]

what's the biggest difference between an i5 or i7 versus the xeon processors? and why would one be chosen over another?

[f700es]

f700es, looking at the parts difference with the items you gave me from newegg, there is a $1000 difference. but how much of that do you think would be made up for in the time it takes to build the system plus any additional parts like the tower frame, additional wires, etc. that is needed to actually put it all together?

 

Well 1st off these are 2 different animals. Without comparing them I have no idea if the Xeon would be better than the Sandy Bridge based i7. I checked at Newegg and that CPU is out of stock. That is an older socket design as well, that Xeon is based on the LGA 1366 while the core i7 I spec'ed is a LGA 2011, a newer design. So with that I don't know if the Xeon would still be "better". The Xeon is also based on the older "Bloomfield" design which has been superseded by Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge. More to look at than the CPU. I mean you have ECC ram and that video card is a pro level as well. I mean all the cables and such would come with the parts I spec'ed. Most mother boards come with the SATA data cables and the power supply would have the needed cables to connect to the case and mother board.

 

That just seems a bit expensive to me for an older model Xeon and I usually like Dells.

[gbelous]

okay, thanks. just trying to form a case about why i need a new computer and why this would be the best one for me and my use

[f700es]

what's the biggest difference between an i5 or i7 versus the xeon processors? and why would one be chosen over another?

 

Well they are different classes of CPU and generally offer better performance as you move up the ladder, from i3 to i5 to i7 (link). I know that the i5 cpu does not support HT (hyper threading) which "doubles" the threads that the CPU uses. A HT P4 would show up as a dual core CPU in older models. A HT quad core i7 will show up as an 8-core cpu so it "technically" give you more processing cores to use. Current 6-core units show up as 12 cores so if your OS and application are coded to use this you can gain significant performance from their use. There might be some dual core based i5 units that support HT but I don't think the quads do.

 

Xeon based cpus are generally used for server and workstations. I think the main difference is the support for ECC memory and they usually have the same architecture as the core models. Most can't be over-clocked. ECC ram is more expensive and so are Xeon based cpus. You can google and read more into most of this.

 

Anyway these are my generalizations and more accurate info can be found online.

Edited September 20, 2012 by f700es

[gbelous]

thanks. things are slowly making more sense lol at least about how cad reacts with the processors and whatnot.

I think he puts the xeon in the running only because they are standard when customizing on the dell site. other than that i don't know his reasoning.

any 3D we do is also in cad, but we use programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, flash, sketchup sometimes so not sure what their ideal processor type would be. sometimes multiple programs open at the same time.

 

lol right now i have one cad file, outlook, and google chrome open with a few tabs and my memory is up at 2.89 out of 3 and running at 89%. needless to say it's hard to work in more than one cad file at a time let alone another program.

[f700es]

LOL, I have 3 files open in AutoCAD and 1 file in AutoCAD Arch, A 4mb PDF open in Acrobat Pro X, Chrome (e-mail) and FireFox and I am sitting at 73% of 4 gb

 

 

I am using a Xeon based Lenovo workstation btw. A dual-core E5503 based unit. AutoCAD will use the CPUs in rendering, photoshop will use them as well. Now SketchUp is only single threaded but ram and video card come into play with it.

[f700es]

OK, I looked a bit more into this and I can say that you should NOT get that Xeon based system over a 3rd gen core i7 based system. I went over to http://www.cpubenchmark.net and looked at both CPUs and the i7 blows that Xeon W3565 out of the water. I compared a core i7 that you can get in the Dell XPS 8500 to the quoted system you supplied.

The i7-3770 in the XPS scores a 10,363 on their benchmark test. The Xeon W3565 in the other system scores a 6,027 on their test.

Link for high-end CPUs - link and for each CPU...

Core i7-3770 - link

Xeon W3565 - link

 

As for video cards the AMD FirePro V5900 scored a 1,765 while the AMD Radeon HD7870 scored a 3,391. Again a higher score is a better score.

The nVidia GF GTX 660Ti scored a 3,251 but their tests don't seem to hit OpenGL - link. I still prefer the nVidia based cards myself.

 

Just some information to look over.

[gbelous]

thanks, that information is great! i will pass it along to the it guy. just hope he doesn't think i'm stepping on his toes at all, but if i'm going to ask my bosses for a $3k computer i want to make sure it's the best investment we can get

[gbelous]

he said that he's worked with both processors and they seem about the same. plus the precisions come with a 3 year warrantee

[gbelous]

any preference between NVIDIA QUADRO 600 vs AMD FIREPRO V5900, both are for the precision line

[f700es]

he said that he's worked with both processors and they seem about the same. plus the precisions come with a 3 year warrantee

 

Unless he has used both doing exactly what you are doing then I must say that he really hasn't Can't you get a 3 year warranty on the XPS?

[f700es]

any preference between NVIDIA QUADRO 600 vs AMD FIREPRO V5900, both are for the precision line

 

Check the site I listed above and see how they did. I'd always pick an nVidia over an AMD/ATI card anyday but it looks like the AMD scored a much better # than the low-end quadro.

[gbelous]

i did look and compare that site and i even said to him how much higher a score the i7 had over the xeon and he replied with

"bench marking is great but only an issue at the extreme use of the computer

this computer won’t have a issue for at least 4 years processor time"

 

to which i asked what is different between the xps and precision since they use completely different processors, graphics card and hard drives. and he replied "Precisions are built with better components…xps goes for the look along with performance.. but not quite as good of components"

 

i haven't even gotten into the graphics card argument since we haven't really concluded on the processor