residential: do you draw 4" or 3 1/2" stud walls?

[Dana W]

Where i work, we draw 4" thickness to account for the 1/2" sheet rock and 6 " to account for the sheetrock and sheathing. If you ask me, it is more precise because you're not ignoring the extra inch those items add to final dimensions.---at least that's what i have always figured.

 

3 1/2" + 1/2" + 1/2" doesn't quite add up to 4". Once again, out in the field, you really do not want your framing carpenter to have to sit down and subtract all those 1/2" 's from what he has to locate. I really don't understand why there is an issue with this. These are intented to be working drawings, right? Nobody needs the measurement of the drywall. It simply goes on the wall. How to find where to put the exterior finishes is another problem. Without the 1/2" there, do you suppose the contractor will simply assume that there is to be nothing installed on the studs?

 

This stuff is what details and sections are for, and I still don't dimension anything but the studs.

[f700es]

Gonna have to give this the +3.

 

3 1/2" + 1/2" + 1/2" doesn't quite add up to 4". Once again, out in the field, you really do not want your framing carpenter to have to sit down and subtract all those 1/2" 's from what he has to locate. I really don't understand why there is an issue with this. These are intented to be working drawings, right? Nobody needs the measurement of the drywall. It simply goes on the wall. How to find where to put the exterior finishes is another problem. Without the 1/2" there, do you suppose the contractor will simply assume that there is to be nothing installed on the studs?

 

This stuff is what details and sections are for, and I still don't dimension anything but the studs.

[ReMark]

Layout the wall center lines and it won't matter what the actual thickness of the wall is. Isn't the size of dimensional lumber "nominal" anyway? I have seen variations between lumber bought at two different "big box" stores.

[f700es]

Yes, yes you can and it does/can work. We had issues with this when I worked for a developer and had fewer errors with dims just on one side of the wall.

 

Layout the wall center lines and it won't matter what the actual thickness of the wall is. Isn't the size of dimensional lumber "nominal" anyway? I have seen variations between lumber bought at two different "big box" stores.

[SLW210]

What if I want to use hardwood?

[ReMark]

What if I want to use hardwood?

Really? You are going to be so quoted on that. If you want to use your hardwood nobody is going to stop you.

 

Let me know when you plan on framing out that next house with oak, mahogany, teak or ipe.

[Jack_O'neill]

What if I want to use hardwood?

 

My old house was framed with true 2 x 4 and 2 x 6 white oak. The roof was decked with random width 1" thick white oak. Really made it a challenge to put a new roof on, or change something.

[Cad Monkey 2]

I've been going back and forth on this one myself.

When I drew with basic AutoCAD I always used just 4" or 6" - mostly because it was sooo much easier than entering 3.5" everytime I offset a line to create a wall. With Architecture/ADT it's easy to draw all the walls at exactly what width they really are. So then you have to decide if you want to show the width of the stud or the width of the entire wall with drywall. I have done both depending on the job. Usually I do the stud width, but if it's entirely an interior remodel etc. it might make more sense to to use the finish wall width. What I think would be ideal is to use a wall that shows the core (stud, CMU etc.) AND the finish material (drywall, siding etc.) but then dimension to the structural core material. This is possible and I tried it, but it was a big pain in the ass, mostly because I had to zoom in really tight to make sure the dimensions were snapping to the right place. If someone has a better way to do that I would be interested.

[nestly]

I had to zoom in really tight to make sure the dimensions were snapping to the right place. If someone has a better way to do that I would be interested.

 

Put the drywall/sheeting on a separate layer from the framework, and turn off the drywall layer when dimensioning?

[Dana W]

What if I want to use hardwood?

 

A friend of mine is in the position to sell a couple of white oak trees that were storm damaged. They are worth roughly 40,000 dollars pre-milled.

 

Do you want that quarter, flat or rift sawn?

 

I can do all the pre-drilling for the nails on site, for about 80 grand.

[SLW210]

Really? You are going to be so quoted on that. If you want to use your hardwood nobody is going to stop you.

 

Let me know when you plan on framing out that next house with oak, mahogany, teak or ipe.

 

Houses are still built with hardwood framing.

 

My house built in 1925 is all hardwood construction.

 

Hardwoods are sized differently than softwoods.

 

Pre-1961 is sized differently as well as pre-1956 and pre-1928.

 

 

My old house was framed with true 2 x 4 and 2 x 6 white oak. The roof was decked with random width 1" thick white oak. Really made it a challenge to put a new roof on' date=' or change something.[/quote']

 

Unfinished hardwood, then throw in S1S (surfaced 1 side) and S2S (surfaced 2 sides).

 

We paid dearly to redo the roof a couple years ago.

[Cad Monkey 2]

Put the drywall/sheeting on a separate layer from the framework, and turn off the drywall layer when dimensioning?

 

Well, yeah...if drawing the walls as 2D linework only. I was refering to using 3D walls in ADT/Architecture that has a drywall layer element to it. There is probably a way to turn it off temporarily while dimensioning, but I haven't looked into it. I guess the other thing that wasn't working well (again using 3D walls) was that it was difficult to have to always keep in mind that extra 1/2" on each side when laying it out - I just always felt like I was constantly having to adjust 1/2" here and there and everywhere. Part of this is because ADT/Architecture uses the most outside edge of the wall (in this case the drywall) as the baseline, so it just ended up being too much of a hassle.

One case for using 4" or 6" walls is that it just splits the difference between a bare stud wall and a stud wall with drywall and I think this actually works out pretty well most of the time.

[SuperCAD]

Layout the wall center lines and it won't matter what the actual thickness of the wall is.

 

Or save yourself the extra work of additional lines/points and measure to one side of the wall.

[SuperCAD]

One case for using 4" or 6" walls is that it just splits the difference between a bare stud wall and a stud wall with drywall [on one side only] and I think this actually works out pretty well most of the time.

 

Fixed it for you.

[Jack_O'neill]

Houses are still built with hardwood framing.

 

My house built in 1925 is all hardwood construction.

 

Hardwoods are sized differently than softwoods.

 

Pre-1961 is sized differently as well as pre-1956 and pre-1928.

 

 

 

 

Unfinished hardwood, then throw in S1S (surfaced 1 side) and S2S (surfaced 2 sides).

 

We paid dearly to redo the roof a couple years ago.

 

Mine was rough sawn. The guy that built the house was not a carpenter, he just needed a place to live. Traded some timber for enough lumber to build the house. Trees were cut from around where the house was standing. And yes, he built it from green lumber. I've seen many places where the sap had run down the side of the board. On the plus side, the old part of the house that was built this way is well over a century old.

[ReMark]

And how were the drawings for your house done Jack?

[Dana W]

Betcha jack's house was drawn on a piece of squaw chewed deerskin.

[ReMark]

Moses brought down the plans for Jack's house on the third tablet. But it broke! That's why Jack's house is crooked.

[danellis]

Jack's house is measured in Cubits..

 

dJE

[Jack_O'neill]

And how were the drawings for your house done Jack?

 

Wernt no dang drawins, it's just a skwar house...had it bilt afore yer cud get it drawd.

 

The guy that built it was not a carpenter, he was a farmer that needed a house to live in. Studs range from 14" to 28" apart. One was too long so it sits in the wall at about a 15 degree angle. And yes, the wood paneling was cut to match. Every wall was broken by a door or window or both. Originally was 20' x 30' with three rooms. Rock and mortar foundation (and I do mean rocks, like picked up out of the hay field). Indoor plumbing and electricity were added when such things became fashionable. They guy that put the bathroom on was an even worse carpenter than the original. Cut one of the floor joists about 4" short. Didn't replace it or scab on...drove 2 giant spikes in from the outside of the sill plate into the end of the board. Stood that way for nearly 50 years till I came along and replaced the pine floor boards that were getting spongy. Each room had one light fixture in the exact middle of the ceiling, and one outlet...one...up high on the wall next to the switch for the light. Fuse box had 2 thirty amp fuses. Wiring was 2 conductor #10 hard drawn copper with paper insulation inside a rubber coating. And that was just the easy stuff!