I need to clear span the garage, any cad details out there?

[buildman]

Hey to everybody;

 

Over the years I used laminate beams when I needed to clear span space in residential homes, especially garages and great rooms. I been out of it for a long time now so my question is this, what's the latest thing going to clear span a garage or great room area? the span is 24'-6" to outside walls. To add insult to injury I have 16' feet over the garage that will be floored for future living space.

 

Anybody up on the latest greatest and where can I find the cad details for this little project.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

James

[ReMark]

One option you can use is Parallam® parallel strand lumber (PSL) beams.

 

http://www.ilevel.com/floors/f_ParallamPSL_beams.aspx

 

Another might be the use of a wood "I" joist.

 

http://i-joist.org/

[nicolas]

Here we need an engineer certification for an effective span exceeding 5m. Now you are talking about an 8m span + additional spaces above. Answers to your post will be indeed interesting. I am personally looking for tables depicting span|sectional area of concrete|sectional area of steel for T-Beam, Columns and Slab. I am also working on RC Beam details and as soon as I have enough info I will post preliminary works here for discussion.

 

So far I know, the greater the span and the load, the greater the concrete section and If we want to limit oversize sections, we increase area of tensile and compression steel reinforcement as well as shear reinforcement in terms of stirrups. I remember reading in a Design book about opting for the concrete as design basis, for the thought expressed was that the concrete needs to crack for the steel to start working and this is not recommended. I don't know the truthfulness of this or perhaps it's misread.

 

A book that puts everything together in contrast to so much pluralism and myths will be most welcomed.

 

Regards,

 

Nicolas.

[ReMark]

You might look into the use of a steel beam. We used a W16x36 to clear span 40' as part of a pipe rack.

[nestly]

TJI is what everyone around here uses for engineered wood floor joists.

 

http://www.ilevel.com/floors/f_TJI_joists.aspx

[emwhite]

You can use steel joists to span that distance without much issue.

http://www.clarkwestern.com/documents/supportDocs/Span%20Charts/7-Floor%20Joist%20Limiting%20Spans.pdf

 

Typical residential loading is 10psf dead & 40psf live. If you plan to put any heavy tile or use concrete floor, I would use a heavier dead load and the amount to use would depend on your material selection.

 

Assuming you are using 10psf dead, 40psf live load, 2' oc and clear span:

You could use a 1200S200-97 joist (Which is a 12" x 2" x 12ga stud).

[buildman]

One option you can use is Parallam® parallel strand lumber (PSL) beams.

 

http://www.ilevel.com/floors/f_ParallamPSL_beams.aspx

 

Another might be the use of a wood "I" joist.

 

http://i-joist.org/

 

Before I responded back I took a look at the information on both of these sites, I've seen the LVL beams used in some cases but not on any project I've done myself, all of these beams are new to me so I've got a lot of reading and studying to do, one thing is certain, there seems to be a cutoff on some of these beams at 24' feet, so before jumping to the next level, looks like I'm going to be shrinking that garage by 6 inches.

 

Thanks for the info, some good stuff.

 

James

Edited August 31, 2011 by buildman

[emwhite]

Before I responded back I took a look at the information on both of these sites, I've seen the LVL beams used in some cases but not on any project I've done myself, all of these beams are new to so I've got a lot of reading and studying to do, one thing is certain, there seems to be a cutoff on some of these beams at 24' feet before jumping to the next level, looks like I'm going to be shrinking that garage by 6 inches.

 

Thanks for the info, some good stuff.

 

James

 

Typically clear span is assumed from inside to inside of bearing walls but then again you at the very limits of that member. Plus there are safety factors built in. Just some things to keep in mind.

[Tankman]

Thanks for the post emwhite, saved the *.pdf file for future reference.

 

Used lots of steel beams, when structural, in BIG commercial buildings.

 

"I" beams, largest I've used 48" BIG, never goin' anywhere. Of course, steel posts for vertical support.

 

Thanks again for the reference material. And another reference, steel, attached.

Castellated_Beam_Design.dwg

Edited August 31, 2011 by Tankman

[buildman]

Here we need an engineer certification for an effective span exceeding 5m. Now you are talking about an 8m span + additional spaces above. Answers to your post will be indeed interesting. I am personally looking for tables depicting span|sectional area of concrete|sectional area of steel for T-Beam, Columns and Slab. I am also working on RC Beam details and as soon as I have enough info I will post preliminary works here for discussion.

 

Hi Nicolas

 

So far I know, the greater the span and the load, the greater the concrete section and If we want to limit oversize sections, we increase area of tensile and compression steel reinforcement as well as shear reinforcement in terms of stirrups. I remember reading in a Design book about opting for the concrete as design basis, for the thought expressed was that the concrete needs to crack for the steel to start working and this is not recommended. I don't know the truthfulness of this or perhaps it's misread.

 

A book that puts everything together in contrast to so much pluralism and myths will be most welcomed.

 

Regards,

 

Nicolas.

 

Nicolas;

 

A very nice read, I fully agree to the engineer certification, most of the suppliers of these beams have engineers and they will usually be very helpful if your buying their products.

 

Thanks for posting.

 

James

[buildman]

You can use steel joists to span that distance without much issue.

http://www.clarkwestern.com/documents/supportDocs/Span%20Charts/7-Floor%20Joist%20Limiting%20Spans.pdf

 

Typical residential loading is 10psf dead & 40psf live. If you plan to put any heavy tile or use concrete floor, I would use a heavier dead load and the amount to use would depend on your material selection.

 

Assuming you are using 10psf dead, 40psf live load, 2' oc and clear span:

You could use a 1200S200-97 joist (Which is a 12" x 2" x 12ga stud).

 

Thanks for the info, I'm sure others will also find this to be most useful, I agree with you on the residential loads.

 

We can usually find a piece of steel to span almost anything, the only problem then is to find a crane big enough to lift it.

 

Again thanks

 

James

[buildman]

TJI is what everyone around here uses for engineered wood floor joists.

 

http://www.ilevel.com/floors/f_TJI_joists.aspx

 

Thanks for providing this informating, I'm looking it over now.

 

Thanks

 

James

[nicolas]

Thanks for the info. I have downloaded the span tables provided. I hope to find one regarding Reinforced Concrete soon.

[emwhite]

Thanks for the post emwhite, saved the *.pdf file for future reference.

 

Used lots of steel beams, when structural, in BIG commercial buildings.

 

"I" beams, largest I've used 48" BIG, never goin' anywhere. Of course, steel posts for vertical support.

 

Thanks again for the reference material. And another reference, steel, attached.

 

No problem! It was an innocent plug because the company I work for uses the same joist (we have titled as something else) but it's rolled by Clark Western.

 

Yea, I've been in residential building my whole career. I've done some red iron homes that were detailed similar to your drawing. Now I'm in the light gauge industry drawing homes and light commercial. We rarely used I-beams and they are typically miniature compared to that 48" tall beast! lol

 

A friend of mine works for a moving company that specializes in moving buildings, reactors, gas processing equipment, etc. He was showing me some of the beams they use and they were huge! The trailers to haul that stuff is neat too.

 

 

 

Thanks for the info, I'm sure others will also find this to be most useful, I agree with you on the residential loads.

 

We can usually find a piece of steel to span almost anything, the only problem then is to find a crane big enough to lift it.

 

Again thanks

 

James

 

No problem! I deal with it on a daily basis. The joist I spec'd out weighs roughly 5.5lb/ft. So no crane needed!

 

I work with light gauge trusses that can clear span 30'-40' on average and weigh roughly 100-150lbs (roof truss, 6:12 pitch). So two people could move it around with no problems! Those two guys could just pass the truss up to the guys up on the top plate who would set it in place while they fetched another truss.